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Let $f(x)=x^4+b_3 x^3+ b_2 x^2+b_1 x + b_0$.

Let $g(x)=x^4 f(1/x)$. Let $C : g(x)=y^2$.

$C$ is birationally equivalent to $f(x)=y^2$.

The constant coefficient of $g(x)$ is $1$ since $f$ is monic and $(0,1)$ is on $C$.

On the internet we found reduction quartic with square coefficient to Weierstrass model of the elliptic curve with point of infinite order.

One family of failures are $f(x)=x^4+b_2 x^2 + b_0$.

Q1 Is every sufficiently general monic quartic rational square infinitely often?

Q2 Is this known?

sagemath session with the reduction:

sage: K.<x>=QQ[]
sage: f=x^4+5*x^3+x^2+13*x+2;g=numerator(x^4*f(1/x))
sage: E,phi,psi,poi=quarToEll(g)
sage: P2=3*E(poi);P2.order()
+Infinity
sage: Pq=psi[0](P2.xy()),psi[1](P2.xy())
sage: factor(f(1/Pq[0]))
2^-16 * 13^-4 * 137^2 * 5940889^2


def quarToEll(pol,v0=None,q0=None):
# if v^2=a*u^4+b*u^3+c*u^2+d*u+q^2 (i.e. with rat point (0,q))
# this function gives Weierstrass equation and maps
# result is in the format [ell,[x,y],[u,v]] where ell
# is the Weierstrass elliptic curve
# [x,y] are given in terms of u,v and [u,v] given in terms
# of x,y
    qq,d,c,b,a=pol.coefficients(sparse=False) #pol.coeffs()
    #if v0 != None:
    #   q=v0
    #else:  
    try:
        if not qq.is_square():
            print ('non square')
            return []
        #q=ZZ(qq).isqrt()
    except:  pass   
    pr2=PolynomialRing(pol.base_ring(),'z1')
    z1=pr2.gen()
    if q0 is None:
        polr=z1**2-qq
        rots=polr.roots(multiplicities=False)
        q=rots[0]
    else:  q=q0 
    
    a1=d/q
    a2=c-d**2/(4*q**2)
    a3=2*q*b
    a4=-4*q**2*a;
    a6=a2*a4
    eli=[a1,a2,a3,a4,a6]
    ell=EllipticCurve(pol.parent().base_ring(),eli)
    prxy=PolynomialRing(pol.parent().base_ring(),'x,y')
    x,y=prxy.gens()
    pruv=PolynomialRing(pol.parent().base_ring(),'u,v')
    u,v=pruv.gens()

    P1=[(2*q*(v+q)+d*u)/u**2,(4*q**2*(v+q)+2*q*(d*u+c*u**2)-d**2*u**2/(2*q))/u**3]
    f=(2*q*(x+c)-d**2/(2*q))/y
    g=-q+f*(f*x-d)/(2*q)
    P2=[f,g]

    point1= [-a2,a1*a2-a3]

    return [ell,P1,P2,point1]
$\endgroup$
7
  • $\begingroup$ The formulation is not completely clear! Is the following reformulation of your questions correct. Q1. Given a monic quartic polynomial $f(x)$, are there infinitely many solutions of $y^2=f(x)$? Q2. Is this well-known? $\endgroup$
    – Kapil
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 9:41
  • $\begingroup$ Secondly, you seem to assert that there is a point of infinite order on this elliptic curve based on the fact that the point "$x=\infty$" on the projective line lies below two rational points on the curve of genus 1. This is presumably the assertion that requires the poynomial $f$ to be general. $\endgroup$
    – Kapil
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 9:45
  • $\begingroup$ @Kapil Thanks. This is close to what I suggest, but there are known counterexamples to your formulation like $f(x)=x^4+b x^2 + c$. $\endgroup$
    – joro
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 9:46
  • $\begingroup$ I was just about to say that this case corresponds to the case where the difference between the two points at $\infty$ in this case is a point of order 2 (I think!). $\endgroup$
    – Kapil
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 9:49
  • $\begingroup$ General heuristics about elliptic curves are formulated in terms of the short Weierstrass model, but I imagine they would still apply for the quartic form. In that case for general enough curves you expect the rank to be zero 50% of the time, and to be one 50% of the time (and to be higher with asymptotic density zero). In particular, not every sufficiently general curve will have infinitely many rational points. $\endgroup$
    – Wojowu
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 12:37

1 Answer 1

3
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The genus one curve given by $$y^2=x^4 + b_3 x^3 + b^2 x^2+b_1 x+ b_0$$ in one affine chart and $$z^2 = b_0 w^4 + b_1 w^3 + b_2 w^2 + b_3 w +1$$ in another affine chart (glued by $w = 1/x, z = y/x^2$), has two rational points $w=0, z = \pm 1$. Choosing one, say $(0,1)$ as the origin for the group law, this is an elliptic curve.

Hence the elliptic curve has infinitely many rational points as long as the remaining one, $(0,-1)$, is not a torsion point. If it is a torsion point, then by Mazur's theorem (because everything is defined over $\mathbb Q$) it must have order $1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,$ or $12$.

For each of those numbers, the set where $(0,-1)$ is torsion of that order is a closed subset of the space with coordinates $b_0,b_1,b_2,b_3$. To check that it is a proper closed subset, it suffices to find one elliptic curve where that point has infinite order, which is easy to do. (This can also be done by a geometric argument).

So for any $b_0,b_1,b_2,b_3$ outside a finite union of proper closed subsets (i.e. sufficiently general) there are infinitely many rational points. One can find these closed subsets explicitly using the group law of the elliptic curve (division polynomials).


Why is the minimalist conjecture, suggested by Wojowu, not relevant here? The reason is that we are dealing with a geometric family of elliptic curves, rather than all elliptic curves.

However, the minimalist conjecture can be generalized to apply to an arbitrary family of elliptic curves, and in much greater generality to geometric families of L-functions, as was essentially done by Sarnak, Shin, and Templier.

In this context, the right conjecture to make is that for any family of elliptic curves parameterized by a reasonable variety (e.g. projective space, or even a Fano variety with no obstruction to rational points) 100% of curves should have rank equal to the minimum number greater than the rank of the family (i.e. the number of independent sections in the Mordell-Weil group of the generic fiber), whose parity matches the sign of that curve's L-function.

In this context, the signs are surely equidistributed, so we can predict 50% have rank 1 and 50% have rank 2.

Some families (e.g. K3 surfaces studied by Noam Elkies) have a quite high rank, so generic members have rank distributions that are strange from the perspective of the family of all elliptic curves!

$\endgroup$
5
  • $\begingroup$ Thanks. I can't map neither (0,1) nor (0,-1) to the Weierstrass form because of division by zero. $\endgroup$
    – joro
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 15:53
  • $\begingroup$ @joro I can't read your code very well, but to avoid division by zero you can either use the equation to manipulate the rational functions so there is not a zero in both the numerator and denominator, or else write the first few coefficients of a solution of the equation in bower series around $(0,1)$ or $(0,-1)$, plug the power series into your formula, and clear a power of the variable. One of them should map to the point at infinity, the other to a finite point. $\endgroup$
    – Will Sawin
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 16:33
  • $\begingroup$ In my $z, w$ notation, the power series is $z = \pm ( 1 + (b_3/2) w + (b_2/2- b_3^2/8)w^2 + \dots)$. If you plug that in you should be able to clear a power of $w$ (depending on $+$ or $-$ ) $\endgroup$
    – Will Sawin
    Commented Jan 30, 2021 at 16:35
  • $\begingroup$ Thank you for pointing out the flaw in my (naive) reasoning. Could you explain what is exactly meant with "geometric family of elliptic curves" here? $\endgroup$
    – Wojowu
    Commented Feb 1, 2021 at 14:00
  • 1
    $\begingroup$ @Wojowu I just mean any elliptic curve defined by an equation whose coefficients are polynomials in some variables $x_1,\dots,x_n$, as you specialize to different rational (or integer) values of the variables $x_1,\dots,x_n$. Alternately, you can look at a morphism $\mathcal E \to X$ where $X$ is a Fano variety and the generic fiber is an elliptic curve. $\endgroup$
    – Will Sawin
    Commented Feb 1, 2021 at 14:05

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