33
$\begingroup$

I will first ask the question which can be stated very simply. Afterwards I will explain some motivation and give references to related sequences.

Consider the sequence defined by $$b_n = \frac{(b_{n-1} + 1)(b_{n-2} + 1)(b_{n-3} + 1)(b_{n-4}+1)}{b_{n-5}}$$ where $b_0 = b_1 = b_2 = b_3 = b_4 = 1$.

Question: Is $b_n \in \mathbb{Z}$ for all $n \geq 0$?

Provided my program is correct, I have found that $b_n \in \mathbb{Z}$ for $0 \leq n \leq 36$.

I came to this thinking about MO323867 which asks for sequences that have all integer values but do not satisfy the Laurent phenomenon. More generally we can consider the sequence defined by

$$a^{(k)}_n = \frac{\prod_{i=1}^{k-1} (a^{(k)}_{n-i} + 1)}{a^{(k)}_{n-k}}$$

with $a_0 = a_1 = \cdots = a_{k-1} = 1$.

  • When $k=2$ we obtain $a^{(2)}_n a^{(2)}_{n-2} = a^{(2)}_{n-1} + 1$ which can be seen coming from a type $A_2$ cluster algebra which implies the Laurent phenomenon and integrality (see A076839).

  • When $k=3$ we have the Laurent phenomenon and hence the sequence is all integers (see A276123). The Laurent phenomenon follows for a more general result in Theorem 6.2.3 of the thesis of Matthew Russell.

  • When $k = 4$ the sequence does not exhibit the Laurent phenomenon, but it is still a sequence of integers (see A276175, MO248604, MSE1905063).

  • When $k = 5$ we have the sequence from the question asked above.

  • When $k > 5$ the sequence does not consist of only integers with the first violation being $a^{(k)}_{2k} \not\in \mathbb{Z}$. This can be seen by looking at the 2-adic valuation. In particular, it can be shown $\nu_2(a^{(k)}_{2k}) = 5-k$ for $k \geq 5$. To see this we can work $\pmod{2^5}$ and find that $(a^{(k)}_{2k-1} + 1) \equiv 2^4 \pmod{2^5}$. It is clear that $a_k = 2^{k-1}$ and $a_{n}$ is even, equivalently $(a_{n}+1)$ is odd, for $k \leq n < 2k - 1$.

So, the sequence $b_n$ corresponding to $k=5$ is the only sequence in the family which I do not know if all terms are integers.

$\endgroup$
11
  • 5
    $\begingroup$ The obvious Mathematica code (and an hour on my laptop) confirmed integrality up to $n=41$. $\endgroup$ Commented Feb 24, 2019 at 4:37
  • 3
    $\begingroup$ These numbers get big fast! I noticed that the last digits seem to be always be 1 or 6. Moreover, after some initial "noise," the repeating pattern is 6, 6, 6, 6, 1, 1, 1 (starting at $n=11$). Looking modulo 30, from the same point the repeating pattern is 16, 16, 16, 16, 1, 1, 1. $\endgroup$ Commented Feb 24, 2019 at 19:03
  • $\begingroup$ I can't find a proof that for $k\ge5$, we have $(a^{(k)}_{2k-1} + 1) \equiv 2^4 \pmod{2^5}$. Would you give more hints? thanks! $\endgroup$
    – René Gy
    Commented Feb 25, 2019 at 19:37
  • $\begingroup$ Kevin, thanks for the computations. It's always nice to have additional verification. Brian, thanks for the interesting observation. @RenéGy for k=5 one can computer mod 32 and find 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 16, 8, 4, 26, 15. For k>5 it will be an initial segment of 1s, followed by some 0s, followed by 16, 8, 4, 26, 15. Note the 0s don't really change things since we multiply by 0+1=1 in the recurrence. $\endgroup$ Commented Feb 26, 2019 at 15:54
  • 3
    $\begingroup$ I'm not 100% convinced the $k=4$ case is really resolved. $\endgroup$ Commented Feb 27, 2019 at 16:24

2 Answers 2

7
$\begingroup$

This is more of a comment on your sequences than an answer to your question; unfortunately I do not have enough points to post a comment yet.

The sequences $(a_n^{(k)})_{n=0}^\infty$ labelled by $k=2, 3, \ldots $ that you consider all exhibit a "hidden" positive Laurent Phenomenon, i.e. a positive Laurent Phenomenon after a suitable change of variables.

More precisely, set $a_0^{(k)} = y_0$ and $a_j^{(k)} = y_j \prod_{i=0}^{j-1}(1+a_i^{(k)})$ for $j=1, \ldots, k-1$.

Claim:([Lemma 2.13, dSG23]) For all $n$, the element $a_n^{(k)}$ is a Laurent polynomial, with positive integer coefficients, in the variables $y_0, y_1, \ldots, y_{k-1}$.

In particular, the sequence $(a_n^{k})$ evaluated at $y_0 = \ldots = y_{k-1}=1$, or equivalently at $a_0^{(k)}=1$ and $a_j^{(k)} = (a_{j-1}^{(k)})^2+a_{j-1}^{(k)}$ for $j = 1, \ldots, k-1$, consists entirely of positive integers. Such a sequence is called a $\textit{unitary Y-frieze pattern}$ in [dSG23].

Example: For $k=4$, we write $a_k^{(4)} = a_n$ for convenience. Set $a_0 = y_0$, $a_1 = y_1(1+y_0)$, $a_2 = y_2(1+y_0)(1+y_1(1+y_0))$ and $a_3 = y_3(1+y_0)(1+y_1(1+y_0))(1+y_2(1+y_0)(1+y_1(1+y_0)))$. The claim is that every $a_n$ is a Laurent polynomial in $y_0, y_1, y_2$ and $y_3$, with positive integer coefficients.

In particular, specialising $y_0 = \cdots= y_3 = 1$, or equivalently $a_0=1$, $a_1=2, a_2=6, a_3=42$, we obtain a sequence of positive integers.

References

[dSG23]: Y-frieze patterns, A. de Saint Germain, arxiv:2311.03073

$\endgroup$
3
$\begingroup$

I think I can at least show that the only denominators are powers of two.

We have the following recurrence: $$b_n=\frac{b_{n-1}(b_{n-1}+1)}{2}\frac{b_{n-6}b_{n-10}b_{n-14}\dots}{b_{n-4}b_{n-8}b_{n-12}\dots}$$ where $b_i$ is interpreted as $1$ if $i\leqslant 0$ so that the products on top and bottom have a finite number of terms that aren't equal to $1$.

Now suppose that $p$ is an odd prime, and let $n(p)$ be the first value of $n$ such that $\nu=\nu_p(b_n)\ne 0$. Then $p$ is a prime divisor of $b_{n(p)-1}+1$, and from $n(p)$ onwards the values of $\nu_p(n)$ go as follows: $\nu,\ \nu,\ \nu,\ \nu,\ 0,\ 0,\ 0,\ 0,\ 0,\ \dots$ until a further $\nu_p(b_{n-1}+1)$ is non-zero. But this can only happen if $\nu_p(b_{n-1})$ is zero, at which point another sequence of the same form is added in, and so on. The point is that this shows $\nu_p(b_n)$ always stays non-negative.

Finally, we need to deal with $\nu_2$. This seems more mysterious to me. The problem is to understand $\nu_2(b_n+1)$ when $b_n$ is odd.

$\endgroup$
1
  • 2
    $\begingroup$ An alternative way to see that the denominators are powers of two is that each $b_n$ is a positive Laurent polynomial in $y_i$, $i= 0, 1, \ldots , 3$, evaluated at $y_0 = 1$, $y_1 = \frac{1}{2}$, $y_2 = \frac{1}{4}$, $y_3 = \frac{1}{8}$ and $y_4 = \frac{1}{16}$. $\endgroup$ Commented Jul 9 at 3:18

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .