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There seems to be a standard trick in group theory which is to show that a group has a quotient group which "just not" has some property.

To make things clear:

  • let $\mathcal{P}$ be a group property which implies finite presentation and is inherited by quotients
  • let $G$ be a finitely generated group without $\mathcal{P}$
  • then $G$ has a quotient $Q$ which is "just not $\mathcal{P}$", meaning $Q$ does not have $\mathcal{P}$ but all of its proper quotient do.

Question: when (and why) was this trick introduced?

I've seen it with $\mathcal{P}$=polycyclic used in Groves 1978 [Soluble groups with every proper quotient polycyclic]. The argument below is from a paper of Breuillard [On uniform exponential growth for solvable groups]. But there are certainly a few other possibilities ($\mathcal{P}$= finite is the first that comes to mind)

Proof of the trick: Let $G$ be such a group and let $\mathcal{N}$ be the set of all normal subgroups $N$ of $G$, such that $G/N$ does not satisfy $\mathcal{P}$. Suppose $N_1 \subset N_2 \subset ... \subset N_i \subset ...$ is an increasing chain of subgroups from $\mathcal{N}$. And let $N$ be the union of all $N_i$’s. Then $N$ is a normal subgroup of $G$. If $G/N$ had $\mathcal{P}$, it would have a finite presentation $\langle x_1 , ..., x_n \mid r_1 , ..., r_m \rangle$. The finitely many relations $r_i$’s would belong to one of the $N_i$’s, say $N_{i_0}$. Hence $G/N_{i_0}$ would appear as a quotient of $G/N$, hence has $\mathcal{P}$, contradicting the assumption that $G/N_{i_0}$ does not satisfy $\mathcal{P}$. So $G/N$ does not satisty $\mathcal{P}$. It follows that we can apply Zorn’s lemma and obtain a maximal element $M$ in $\mathcal{N}$. Then clearly $G/M$ does not satisfy $\mathcal{P}$, while any proper quotient of it has $\mathcal{P}$.

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    $\begingroup$ Maybe especially the Robinson-Wilson 1984 groups? I remember discussing this argument I think I read there, with Breuillard in December 2004. $\endgroup$
    – YCor
    Commented Feb 15, 2021 at 21:31
  • $\begingroup$ @Ycor thanks for this reference. But isn't this trick (perhaps not with this streamlined argument) prior to that? For example, if I have an infinite group with no [nontrivial] finite quotients, then applying this trick with $\mathcal{P}$=finite, I get a simple group. $\endgroup$
    – ARG
    Commented Feb 16, 2021 at 7:13
  • $\begingroup$ With $\mathcal{P}=$"finite" what you obtain is a "just infinite group" (this is not the same as simple). It appears in two papers by Donald McCarthy (1968, 1970). I haven't checked if it includes the observation that every infinite f.g. group has a just infinite quotient. $\endgroup$
    – YCor
    Commented Feb 16, 2021 at 9:53
  • $\begingroup$ @Ycor I wrote that if you start with a group $G$ which has no finite quotients (like Higman's group), and look at the "just infinite" quotient $Q$ of $G$, then $Q$ is simple (since any proper quotient of $Q$ is finite, and is a quotient of $G$ it must be trivial). This could be a earlier instance of this trick. Thanks for the reference to McCarthy! $\endgroup$
    – ARG
    Commented Feb 16, 2021 at 10:02
  • $\begingroup$ Oops, sorry: sure, you're right, a just-infinite group with no nontrivial finite quotient is indeed simple. But Higman's argument is not really the same, since it doesn't make use of finite presentation (or, if you like, it's the old version of the argument, with $\mathcal{P}$ being the class of trivial groups). $\endgroup$
    – YCor
    Commented Feb 16, 2021 at 10:46

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