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The theory of real closed fields is decidable. The hyperreals satisfy that theory, so we can interpret statements in the theory of real closed fields as being about hyperreals.

If we add a unary predicate for "is a standard real number" to the language, is the theory still decidable?

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  • $\begingroup$ Any reason for the anonymous downvote? $\endgroup$
    – Alec Rhea
    Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 3:24
  • $\begingroup$ Do you mean adding a predicate "standard real"? Because the predicate "is a real number" in the theory of real-closed fields would, in principle, be interpreted as "everything". $\endgroup$
    – Asaf Karagila
    Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 9:16
  • $\begingroup$ @AsafKaragila standard real, yes. $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 12:13
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    $\begingroup$ What happens if you take an ultrapower of that structure, then your "new" hyperreals will have the standard reals predicate cover the "old" hyperreals. $\endgroup$
    – Asaf Karagila
    Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 12:30
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    $\begingroup$ @PyRulez, I don't think that's equivalent to my formula -- suppose $x$ is a positive infinitesimal and $y=2x$. But if you have both division and my proposed expansion, you can express that $y-x$ is a positive infinitesimal by saying that $1/(y-x)$ is not smaller than a standard real. $\endgroup$
    – user44143
    Commented Sep 22, 2020 at 2:30

2 Answers 2

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Yes, the theory is decidable.

If $F$ is an ordered field and $R\subseteq F$ a non-cofinal subfield, then $$O=\{x\in F:\exists u\in R\:(-u\le x\le u)\}$$ is a convex valuation ring of $F$, with maximal ideal $$I=\{x\in F:\forall u\in R_{>0}\:(-u\le x\le u)\}.$$ $R$ embeds as a cofinal subfield in the residue field $O/I$; in general, the embedding may be proper, but if $R=\mathbb R$, then $R=O/I$, as $\mathbb R$ is complete.

Thus, let $T$ be the theory of structures $(F,R,+,\cdot,<)$ such that

  1. $F$ is a real-closed field,

  2. $R$ is a non-cofinal subfield of $F$, and

  3. the canonical embedding of $R$ into the residue field $O/I$ as defined above is surjective (and therefore an isomorphism).

Then $T$ is a recursively axiomatized theory, it is valid in the hyperreal structures $({}^*\mathbb R,\mathbb R)$, and it is complete (see below), hence it is decidable, and axiomatizes the first-order theory of $({}^*\mathbb R,\mathbb R)$.

As pointed out in a comment by Erik Walsberg (thanks!), the completeness of $T$ is a special case of a more general result on tame elementary extensions of o-minimal structures due to Van den Dries and Lewenberg [1]. (Here, tameness is basically the axiom 3 above.) Their results also show that $T$ is model-complete, and in fact, that it has quantifier elimination in a language expanded with function symbols for roots of polynomials (which make the theory of real-closed fields universally axiomatized) and for the “standard part” map $\mathrm{st}\colon O\to R$ such that $x-\mathrm{st}(x)\in I$.

Let me indicate how to prove a weaker result: the theory $T_0$ of structures $(F,O)$ such that

  1. $F$ is a real-closed field,

  2. $O$ is a proper convex subring of $F$,

is complete and decidable. This follows from the Ax–Kochen–Ershov principle, which states that two henselian valued fields of residue characteristic $0$ with elementarily equivalent residue fields and value groups are elementarily equivalent.

First, it is an easy consequence of basic facts about valued fields that if $F$ is a real-closed field with a convex valuation ring $O$, then the valued field $(F,O)$ is henselian, the residue field $O/I$ is real-closed, and the value group $F^\times/O^\times$ is divisible.

Thus, if $(F,O)$ and $(F',O')$ are two models of $T_0$, their residue fields are elementarily equivalent by completeness of the theory of real-closed fields, and their value groups are elementarily equivalent by completeness of the theory of divisible totally ordered abelian groups, hence the valued fields $(F,O)$ and $(F',O')$ are elementarily equivalent by the AKE principle.

As shown by Cherlin and Dickman [2], $T_0$ has quantifier elimination in the language of ordered rings expanded with the predicate $$x\mid y\iff y\in xO.$$

References:

[1] Lou van den Dries, Adam H. Lewenberg: $T$-convexity and tame extensions, Journal of Symbolic Logic 60 (1995), no. 1, pp. 74–102, doi: 10.2307/2275510. On JSTOR.

[2] Gregory Cherlin, Max A. Dickmann: Real closed rings II. Model theory, Annals of Pure and Applied Logic 25 (1983), no. 3, pp. 213–231, doi: 10.1016/0168-0072(83)90019-2.

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  • $\begingroup$ This also makes a good answer to mathoverflow.net/questions/108951/…, where I see that you cite encyclopediaofmath.org/wiki/Model_theory_of_valued_fields as a good resource for the Ax-Kochen-Ershov principle. $\endgroup$
    – user44143
    Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 15:53
  • $\begingroup$ Neat! You wouldn't happen to know if quantifier elimination would work, like Matt F. speculated in a comment under the question? $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 21, 2020 at 16:12
  • $\begingroup$ The language of real closed fields has the $>$ relation. The language that the Ax–Kochen–Ershov principle talks about wouldn't have that, right? $\endgroup$ Commented Oct 2, 2020 at 21:20
  • $\begingroup$ I think it is worth pointing out that completeness of this theory is a special case of the work of van den Dries and Lewenberg on tame pairs. They also get a quantifier elimination in a reasonable language. Their results cover the analogous structure when one replaces the field of real numbers by some o-minimal expansion of the field of real numbers. projecteuclid.org/euclid.jsl/1183744679 $\endgroup$ Commented Oct 3, 2020 at 1:56
  • $\begingroup$ @ErikWalsberg Excelent, thank you. I will look at it when I get to the office. $\endgroup$ Commented Oct 3, 2020 at 5:51
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Here are some comments on quantifier elimination for this theory, focusing on what expansion of the language might make it work. This may be parallel to identifying a model companion, or determining the structures to consider in a more model-theoretic proof, as Emil Jerabek was proposing.

First, we will need a symbol for having a standard real in between, $SBet(x,y)$, to eliminate the quantifier in $$(\exists s)(Std(s)\ \&\ x \le s \le y)$$ We can express many things in terms of this symbol, e.g.

  • $x$ is standard iff $SBet(x,x)$;
  • $x$ is less than some standard real iff $x<0 \vee SBet(x,x+1)$;
  • $x$ is in Emil's ideal $O$ iff $x$ and $-x$ are each less than some standard real

Second, we will need symbols for algebraic functions. We need to be able to say that $\sqrt{x}-y$ is standard, i.e. a quantifier elimination for expressions like $$(\exists r)(Std(r)\ \&\ (r+y)^2 = x)$$

  • One obvious elimination does not work, e.g. if $x=(y+1)^2$ and $y$ is non-standardly large, then $\sqrt{x}-y$ is standard but $x-y^2$ is non-standard.

  • Identifying algebraic functions by bracketing roots in rational intervals also will not work, since we will need roots that are not in rational intervals.

  • We can instead use the sign representation, specifying the signs of the derivatives of the polynomial. So we add a function $a_d$ of $2d+1$ variables for each degree $d$, where we interpret, e.g. $a_2(c_0, c_1, c_2; d_1, d_2)$ as "the root of $c_0 + c_1 x + c_2 x^2$ for which $(c_0 + c_1 x + c_2 x^2)'$ has the same sign as $d_1$ and $(c_0 + c_1 x + c_2 x^2)''$ has the same sign as $d_2$, or $0$ if that description does not specify a unique $x$."

Even these additions don't make the quantifier elimination obvious. How can we eliminate the quantifier over $r$ in $$(\exists r)(SBet(r + x,\ r + 2x)\ \&\ y < r < z)\ \text{ or}$$ $$(\exists r)(SBet(r^3 - r + x,\ r^3 - r + 2x)\ \&\ y < r < z)\ ?$$

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  • $\begingroup$ What's the convention on how to handle values of the algebraic function that are undefined (like 1/0 or sqrt (-1)). $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 30, 2020 at 16:06
  • $\begingroup$ The convention I proposed is a value of "0 when that description does not specify a unique $x$." $\endgroup$
    – user44143
    Commented Sep 30, 2020 at 16:07
  • $\begingroup$ Okay, sure. Do you know how to eliminate the quantifier in $(\exists s)(Std(s)\ \&\ x \lt s \lt y)$? If so, I think I have a solution for your first formula. $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 30, 2020 at 16:13
  • $\begingroup$ In my proposed language, that is equivalent to $SBet(x,y) \ \& \ (Std(x) \rightarrow SBet(x,(x+y)/2)) \ \& \ (Std(y) \rightarrow SBet((x+y)/2,y)$ $\endgroup$
    – user44143
    Commented Sep 30, 2020 at 16:20
  • $\begingroup$ Okay, let's say that the formula I commented above is called SEBet(x, y). Then the first unsolved formula in your question is equivalent to "y < z and SEBet(y+x, z+2x)". $\endgroup$ Commented Sep 30, 2020 at 16:23

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