vote up 2 vote down
star
1

Suppose Q is an atomless countable boolean algebra, and B is an arbitrary atomless boolean algebra. Q is unique modulo isomorphisms. There is a subalgebra in B that is isomorphic to Q. There is probably a mapping from B to Q that preserves all boolean operations, but I need something different. Let f be an epimorphism (cover) from B to Q with the following properties:

1) If b1≤b2 then f(b1)≤f(b2). (previously there was requirement that ∧ should be preserved, but actually I don't need it)

2) f(b1∨b2)=f(b1)∨f(b2)

3) f(b)=0 iff b=0

4) f(1)=1

The negation operation does not need to be preserved.

Does f exist for any B?

Example:

B = {periodic sequences of non-negative reals with integer period}⊆ 2{r≥0}

Q = {periodic sequences of non-negative integers}⊆ 2{k≥0}

f(α)={i : [i,i+1)∩α≠∅}

flag
1 
First sentence: you should add that Q is also atomless (this was confusing me for a little while, and explains the second sentence). – John Goodrick Dec 18 at 21:05

2 Answers

vote up 2 vote down
check

The answer to the revised version of the question is Yes. In fact, there is no need to assume that B is atomless, but rather, only that it is infinite.

Suppose that B is any infinite Boolean algebra. It follows that there is a countable maximal antichain A subset B. The idea of the proof is to map A arbitrarily into your countable atomless Boolean algebra Q, and then extend to B in a way I will describe. Enumerate the maximal antichain A = { an | n in ω } and the nonzero elements of Q as { qn | n in ω}. We will associate an with qn. In order to define f, suppose that b is any element of B. Let Ab = { qn | b ∧ an not = 0 } be the associated set in Q. Define the function f:B to Q by f(b) = ∨ Ab, if Ab is finite, and otherwise f(b)=1.

We now make several observations about this function f. First, the function is clearly onto, since f(an)=qn. Also, f(1)=1, since 1 meets every element of A, and f(0)=0 since 0 meets no elements of A. Moreover, f(b)=0 iff b=0, since no nonzero element of B has zero meet with every element of A, as A was a maximal antichain.

Because (b ∨ c) ∧ a = (b ∧ a) ∨ (c ∧ a), it follows that Ab ∨ c = Ab union Ac. From this, it follows that f(b ∨ c) = f(b) ∨ f(c), since if either set is infinite, then the answer is 1, and if they are finite, we are taking the join of two finite joins. Thus, f is join-preserving.

It follows that f is an order-homomorphism, since b <= c implies b ∨ c = c implies f(b) ∨ f(c) = f(b ∨ c) = f(c) implies f(b) <= f(c).

So f has all the desired properties.

Note that f definitely does not respect negation, since f(neg an) = 1 for every n. And f definitely does not respect meet, since any two elements of A have meet 0, but the corresponding qn must sometimes be nonzero.

This construction has some affinity with your example. Namely, if you take the various half-open unit characteristic functions as the elements of the maximal antichain (and use the corresponding qn's), then your f and my construction are the same.

link|flag
Yeah, this seems to satisfy all requirements, though still not as structure-preserving as I need. Good starting point though, thanks. – Grue Dec 23 at 12:03
Thanks for accepting the answer. What other properties on f did you want? If you really want to handle every Boolean algebra, then it might not be possible to have much more. I say this because I found this answer in part by looking at particular Boolean algebras that I thought might be a counterexample to your property, and I proved for them that every f with your conditions is locally constant. That is, for these B every f has a maximal antichain A below whose elements f is constant. This suggested the solution I gave above. – Joel David Hamkins Dec 23 at 19:22
These problematic Boolean algebras are those corresponding for the forcing to add a Cohen subset to omega_1. This is the canonical method of forcing the Continuum Hypothesis. Such a B has a dense set that is countably closed (every countable descending sequence in the dense set has a nonzero lower bound). – Joel David Hamkins Dec 23 at 19:24
vote up 3 vote down


Edit: This is the answer to the original question. See my other answer for the answer to the revised question.


The answer is that every such f is an isomorphism. Thus, there is such an f only when B is isomorphic to Q.

The main reason is that your conditions imply that f must preserve negation. That is, for any b in B, then

b ^ -b = 0, so you have 0 = f(0) = f(b ^ -b) = f(b) ^ f(-b),

and

b v -b = 1, so you have 1 = f(1) = f(b v -b) = f(b) v f(-b).

So f(b) and f(-b) are complements in Q, and thus f(-b) = -f(b) in Q.

Thus, f preserves all the Boolean algebra structure. Next, since you have f(b)=0 IFF b=0, it means that f must be an isomorphism.

In particular, there is no such f for your example B and Q, since B is uncountable.

If you relax that IFF, then it just means that Q is a quotient of B by the filter F=f^inverse(1).

link|flag
Ok, looks like I made a mistake. Actually I only need the order preserved, not &and; (I thought those were equivalent). The example must work, that's the whole reason for this question. The "iff" part is also important. I changed the requirement 1), how about this revised question? – Grue Dec 18 at 21:23
Preserving join implies preserving the order, since a is less than or equal to b iff a v b =b, so this would give f(a) v f(b) = f(b), which means f(a) is less than or equal to f(b). – Joel David Hamkins Dec 18 at 22:10

Your Answer

Get an OpenID
or

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.